Has anyone used the Empire crank shaft pin kit and still had the damper spin or has it been working well ? I was going to pull stack and I thought while I was in there I would do the kit if it seems to be working well !
Harmonic Damper
- Thread starter torqued2dmax
- Start date
I wouldn't butcher it unless it's actually a problem and needed, I think it mostly happens after someone does a water pump and doesn't torque the the damper bolt or it never was torqued properly from the factory.
Depends on the power you're making. My brother and I spun the factory damper on a LB7 with nothing more than a Silver Bullet turbo and 60% injectors.
Man was that ever a pain to get off the crank
Sent from my Cat S60 using Tapatalk
Man was that ever a pain to get off the crank
Sent from my Cat S60 using Tapatalk
ive heard of guys using it with great luck. Doesnt help the cam pin situation or the crank gear pin but adding that reduces one more issue
As for when it happens, i dont think its just loose bolt/s. my cam pin was half bent over and about to shear when i tore the engine down years ago. the last few engines i did that have been tuned showed bending of the pins as well but not a consistant pattern (some were crank gear pins, others cam and one was the balancer with a tight as hell bolt)
As for when it happens, i dont think its just loose bolt/s. my cam pin was half bent over and about to shear when i tore the engine down years ago. the last few engines i did that have been tuned showed bending of the pins as well but not a consistant pattern (some were crank gear pins, others cam and one was the balancer with a tight as hell bolt)
Must be piss poor luck then my poor old pos has been on a max effort stock engine tune since 06 until a piston finally let go and all the pins looked good on tear down in 17. The few water pump jobs I've done they looked good to and most of them were tuned. I would say once you push over the 500 rwhp mark it would be a good idea though, but after that it's a motor build anyways not if just a matter of time
my poor old pos has been on a max effort stock engine tune since 06 until a piston finally let go and all the pins looked good on tear down in 17. The few water pump jobs I've done they looked good to and most of them were tuned. I would say once you push over the 500 rwhp mark it would be a good idea though, but after that it's a motor build anyways not if just a matter of time
well, i am getting blown up engines, so you know they are beating on them :roflmao:
Some people can break anything and not even try :rofl: One guy can have a measly 50hp tune and he can destroy everything..... Another guy with big hp and races is good for a long time
Thanks for all your feedback , I nave a very slight vibration in park or driving down the road between 1200 and 1400 rpm , very smooth outside of that rpm range . I thought might have bent or partially broke the 5mm pin . The water pump was changed by Black out , a very good shop , so it was done rite but after I took it to Evan for a new trany , and it works great , now I can get on it alot harder and until I get my new eng built I thought the Empire kit might hold it together longer . Thanks, great site ,great people !
Thanks , I love up grading , I will check them out . Maybe its time to do an inj clean . Any thoughts on Empire kit IOWA LLY ?
Well I found that my oem damper just started to d laminate ,so I installed an ATI damper and Empire pin kit , with help from Isaac G and the vibration from 1200 to 1400 rpms is gone , yeaaa ! Thanks guys for input !
BUMP:
Has anyone used the stock OEM knock off damper like this one?
https://www.ebay.com/itm/01-05-6-6L...nic-Balancer-Dorman-594-419-2332/163303056907
cant find any reviews or threads on it. This is the same brand Auto parts stores carry also
Guys with the older 6.2 Diesel are running them with no issues / mixed reviews
Alex
Has anyone used the stock OEM knock off damper like this one?
https://www.ebay.com/itm/01-05-6-6L...nic-Balancer-Dorman-594-419-2332/163303056907
cant find any reviews or threads on it. This is the same brand Auto parts stores carry also
Guys with the older 6.2 Diesel are running them with no issues / mixed reviews
Alex
Last edited:
IMO buy a better damper if yours is junk. I personally like Fluidampr but ATI/SoCal is another great damper. The OEM damper works ok but at ~$300 you're most of the way to a better damper. If you don't plan on ever doing anything more to your truck then stock will work/has worked for many.
do you know why the fluidampr is not the best choice over a factory balancer or an ati/socal? do you know why putting a "better" damper on isnt really all that much better on a stock engine?
sometimes i think you just copy/paste.
Why do you believe that a Fluidampr is not a viable choice? I would argue that is opinion. With the data I have seen from my place of employment (our dampers are Banks viscous dampers, same concept as Fluidampr) on engine testing data/harmonics as well as the data published by Wagler they are definitely a viable option. Is the Fluidampr heavier on a scale at ~24lbs? Yes but it is all not inertial/rotational load. The rotational mass of a Fluidampr is ~16lbs whereas an ATI/SoCal is ~19lbs. The factory pin also doesn't have enough surface area to transfer loads to the damper which is shown by the crank pins eating into factory dampers or being rounded over/snapping. The factory damper also does not have anywhere near the quality of fitment as an aftermarket damper.
I agree they aren't better on a stock engine which is why post reads "if you don't plan on ever doing anything more to your truck then stock will work/has worked for many". I was implying if the OP plans on ever building an engine or thinks he may then it isn't a bad investment now if the OE damper is shot.
Last edited:
stock damper is 17.5 lbs for the guy who just posted asking about them bringing this thread up (LLY), ati/socal is 16.5 lbs for EXTERNALLY balanced engine. your facts from wagler are based off an INTERNALLY balanced engine where the fluid damper works better. Banks doesnt even sell externally balanced dampers for older trucks but even so, they are not rebranded fluidampr, they are tuned to the harmonics they have seen and built the balancer around it. Fluidampr does NOT dampen near as well as the ATI/Socal damper and Guy has plenty to show for it on an externally balanced engine. They will work better on a broader spectrum of harmonics. Fingers has posted info about this as well and done research. the factory damper does a better job at killing harmonics as well since it was again designed around the engine.
regardless of rotational mass, you still have an additional 6-8lbs sitting out on the leverage point of the crank that is not exactly the strongest to begin with. add in the fact it can not work as well in an external balance environment and you are not helping the crank
also will point out the fluidampr is slip fit while Socals/ATI is closer to a press on. less chance of loosing a pin or needing to add a second pin. The pin snapping is a mute point between a fluidampr and stock damper.
All this info is on here.
I did not know the ATI was 16.5lb. On their website they list 19lbs for all years (01-16) for both internal and external balance.
My Fluidampr was pretty tight of a fit and required me to warm it up a touch with a MAP torch. I never once claimed the Banks damper was a rebranded Fluidampr, I said they are the same concept.
The data we have at work (I’m pretty sure you know where I’m employed) shows info between multiple damper styles. Obviously the Banks damper was the best based upon the viscosity being being able to be adjusted and their design of the inertia ring (I don’t have details of what the inside looks like as we’ve never had a failure). The ATI was better at a few specific rpm ranges but the viscous dampers offered lower magnitudes as a whole.
The added mass on the crank is not ideal but I wouldn’t condemn the Fluidampr.
I would have to say that if you are basing this comparison all on old data provided by Guy, then it is not a fair comparison, nor is it fact as you present it. Not only are there newer revisions of the Fluidamper products, but the Majority of diesel engines produced throughout history utilize viscous dampening.
Edit: I just did a search for harmonic data provided by Guy on this site and didn't come across anything. Is it hiding somewhere?
Edit #2: went back to see if Jon ever posted his comparisons from 2015, and didn't see those either. All I'm finding is data posted here, by oems, by auto technology research groups, engineering students, and multiple engine builders that contradicts the claims you've made above.
Last edited: