Hi everyone! Glad to be a member here, lots of good discussions. Here is my dilemma. I have owned an '02 LB7 since 2006. Good truck, no problems, except new injectors around summer, 2008.Courtesy GM., at 108k. Now over 180k, and started getting smoke at idle, so I did the 4 cans of Seafam in 10 gal. diesel, and it almost stopped completely, now I get intermittent hazing from time to time, but it is drivable, with decent mileage. Here's my dilemma. Should I go with the new Sac style injectors and add a Fass, or go with LLY heads and electronics, or just go find a later model with low miles- yeah, right! I am a retired mechanic, so repairs would be for the most part, the cost of parts. I like my truck, and wouold be hard-pressed to find another, but at this stage of the game, Given the issues with ULSD, should I just shoot for something built after 2007? In other words, am I gonna always need to run additives to offset the dry diesel, or will the Sac's solve part of this? I am currently running a Donaldson 3 micron filter on a Nicktane adapter, and adding either Seafoam or Lucas to every tankful. Just asking for opinions and observations. Looks like I may be headed toward injectors very soon, and I'd just like some feedback. BTW truck still looks and operates great! Just want it to be dependable. Also, anybody run Sac's on a stock tune? Problems? Thanks in advance, Guys!
LB7: What to do? New Sac injectors, or new truck?
- Thread starter outtatimexx
- Start date
I swapped my LB7 out for and LBZ, I had no issues with the LB7 other than the cost of injectors.
Mines an 03, it is a little harder to do on a 02, but still doable.
Mines an 03, it is a little harder to do on a 02, but still doable.
sac injectors are amazing i run them in kodiaks all the time at stock power also a lot of pickups that are used just for plowing or landscaping. Changes the exhaust tone, drive ability and longevity of the truck in all positive ways
Only difference is the location of lb7 injectors. I'm stockpiling for a lly swap on my lb7 short block. Best of both worlds
2004 Silverado Cali lb7, Airdog ll 165, fresh sticks at 325k, Rick Fletes Dsp 5 on v2, 33x12.5 nitto at on 20 inch American Racing 20x10 wheels, Stage 5 Built Transmission by Mike Cole with triple disc billet low stall converter, 4 inch Injen cold air intake, Profab Intake Horn, Batmo Wheel, PPE Race Valve, Full EGR Removed w/ fed belt, 3.5 inch MBRP Downpipe, Full five inch MBRP Exhaust axle dump, lbz cp3 pump, Dual Yellow Top Optimas, High Output Alternator, Cognito Pittman and idler w/ support kit, Cognito Upper Contol arms, Drilled and Slotted Rotors on all four Corners, FED Y Bridge, Shantz Custom Fab Traction Bars.
2004 Silverado Cali lb7, Airdog ll 165, fresh sticks at 325k, Rick Fletes Dsp 5 on v2, 33x12.5 nitto at on 20 inch American Racing 20x10 wheels, Stage 5 Built Transmission by Mike Cole with triple disc billet low stall converter, 4 inch Injen cold air intake, Profab Intake Horn, Batmo Wheel, PPE Race Valve, Full EGR Removed w/ fed belt, 3.5 inch MBRP Downpipe, Full five inch MBRP Exhaust axle dump, lbz cp3 pump, Dual Yellow Top Optimas, High Output Alternator, Cognito Pittman and idler w/ support kit, Cognito Upper Contol arms, Drilled and Slotted Rotors on all four Corners, FED Y Bridge, Shantz Custom Fab Traction Bars.
Sac style injector install
Ok, so I think I am going with the sac-style injectors. Question is, do I go ahead and have ecm reprogrammed, or just wait to see how the engine runs? I use this truck strictly for towing, with occasional driving. I am not interested in increased power, smoking burnouts, etc. Truck is now 15 yrs. old with 180k, so it's not a daily driver. Will it damage the engine to run it with the 45% over injectors? How about fuel mileage? 3k is a lot of $ to throw at this at once. Purpose for sac injectors is to make the truck dependable without constant additives. If I do injectors, gskts., pressure lines, etc., and a fass pump, can I wait a while on the tune? already have 3mic. donaldson filt. on Nick adapter. I have a PPE xcelerator tuner I have used in the past for towing, but trk. is currently set to stock. Anybody done this? Thanks!
Ok, so I think I am going with the sac-style injectors. Question is, do I go ahead and have ecm reprogrammed, or just wait to see how the engine runs? I use this truck strictly for towing, with occasional driving. I am not interested in increased power, smoking burnouts, etc. Truck is now 15 yrs. old with 180k, so it's not a daily driver. Will it damage the engine to run it with the 45% over injectors? How about fuel mileage? 3k is a lot of $ to throw at this at once. Purpose for sac injectors is to make the truck dependable without constant additives. If I do injectors, gskts., pressure lines, etc., and a fass pump, can I wait a while on the tune? already have 3mic. donaldson filt. on Nick adapter. I have a PPE xcelerator tuner I have used in the past for towing, but trk. is currently set to stock. Anybody done this? Thanks!
You need to get the ecm programmed to your injectors. Many tuners will write a tune and you send your ecm in to be programmed with just a single tune for a lower price. Your truck will not run correctly at all with the bigger injectors especially being SAC style. Honestly if you do stock injectors back there's really no reason you should have to change them for a good while if you replace with quality remans. Some guys can get 100k off a set or even more depending on how they maintain their truck. I would get stock remans from lincoln diesel. A good FASS setup (I have a Kennedy lift pump and hands down love it. And it's quite a bit cheaper. Then you can get an inline filter mount with a water separator.) that will knock a grand off your bill. If you're not interested in power then that is your best bet for a budget.
I just went through the same dilemma, spent a couple hundred bucks chasing after lbz donor trucks and got burned on the few i looked at (craigslist idiots! one was a 04.5 posted as a lbz) ultimately just decided to get inj. I opted to do everything I could do to insure some longevity, truck has cat adapter, air dog 150, and gets stanadyne regularly, 2nd set of injectors took a turn for the worse this past spring and were hazing people out at stoplights. Decided to give Lincoln Diesel a call and got all new 65% sac injectors, lines, and replaced the rubber lines going to and from the CP3. Truck drives great but haven't got it in for retune yet. On the stock tune you can tell in certain spots that it needs some refinement but it spools super quick and will lay a patch just by stabbing the pedal, I say its worth giving the sac a shot :thumb: hope to see some good results out of them
I maintained mine about as good as anybody, and lost 2 at 70K miles. I started to go back with stockers, but I've seen too many here lately put in good remans, and have them die in 20K miles to roll the dice again.
personally, i wouldnt give up the LLY top end swap to the SAC lb7 injectors. just like everyone says, all year injectors fail and SAC injectors will fail eventually, most likely from high return rates like LLY injectors. then you have a full weekend of tearing down and dealing with pulling injectors and so on. Sure it will probably prolong the issue to 150k out of a set so there is that going for them, but its not a matter of "if", just a matter of "when".
Atleast if you do the top end swap, you gain external injectors which significantly quickens up the change in injectors should you have to change a couple (now you are not changing all 8 or 4 at a time just so you dont have to get back under the valve cover, only what needs to be changed). also much easier to test for return rates and no more cups to deal with that could pressurize your cooling system if you dont seal them up right. Then if you go with a full LLY swap that includes the use of the LLY ECM and FICM and so on, the truck runs much quieter, the option to run a variable vane turbo so you get a turbo brake for towing, and a few other things like auto high idle when cold and some internal tuning perks (something i know you are not concerned with).
The cost will most likely be the same in the end or a little more for the LLY change over if you go the full distance on that. all depends on the deal you get for parts and such to do the swap.
Atleast if you do the top end swap, you gain external injectors which significantly quickens up the change in injectors should you have to change a couple (now you are not changing all 8 or 4 at a time just so you dont have to get back under the valve cover, only what needs to be changed). also much easier to test for return rates and no more cups to deal with that could pressurize your cooling system if you dont seal them up right. Then if you go with a full LLY swap that includes the use of the LLY ECM and FICM and so on, the truck runs much quieter, the option to run a variable vane turbo so you get a turbo brake for towing, and a few other things like auto high idle when cold and some internal tuning perks (something i know you are not concerned with).
The cost will most likely be the same in the end or a little more for the LLY change over if you go the full distance on that. all depends on the deal you get for parts and such to do the swap.
The quieter running engine isn't due to the top end change. Mine is ALOT quieter now after the sac's and some tuning. I've had several comment that it's no louder than there newer models, but has a much deeper exhaust note.
It has a lot to do with the added pre/post pilot injection events and can be made even quieter to the point you think it's an lml. Now that's not stock tuning but with what the lly ecm has available, it can be done much better than the lb7.
Mind sharing some of the idle tables/values that quiet it down? My brother has the RoadRunner in his Suburban so I can't just fiddle with my idle and quiet it down. I'd be curious how far off my half-assed pilot timing is for my SACs vs what some effort yields.
Though I'd understand if you don't want to just give away what you've worked hard for.
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Curious which extra tables in the lly you are refferring to? As far as fueling goes, about the only added tables that amount to much I've seen are the added p/n tables which do help in extremely low load situations.
if it were my work, id be happy to share but Chaves91 is the one that did the work. ill take a video if i get time this weekend of just how quiet it is, im not exaggerating lol
