Wanted: Connecting Rod and bearing specifications

[Hot COCOAL]

So, it's time for me to proceed with this, it's time to pull the engine out of the bay, strip it down and build it up with some performance parts and go for "not broke" lol

I've got a good plan of the parts I will be utilizing for my build...
And a goal to hit 750 on this VGT72 as a single, and as time and mula allows, twin it someday and hit that almighty 1000whp benchmark

The two variables that I haven't nailed down yet are;
Which bearing set to use Clevite H or Hx? And why?

And, which connecting rod manufacturer to purchase?
Howard's, Carrillo, Crower or Manley?

I've haven't seen, read or heard much about the Crower's, other than Pat put one through a block a few years back and it was still straight.

I've read that Howard's come standard with pin oiling holes, but you can get them with Carrillo's for an extra $500

I've read that Carrillo rods are the lightest rods, but I've yet to find a weight for any of the manufacturers.

And from the information I've read, I think Manley rods come standard with the most "processing" to add strength, but I could just be missing info here and there or it could be that Manley just advertises their process more? IDK...

First I'll say, I know any of these options are going to be strong enough for what I'm trying to do, I'm pretty sure they all have failed at some point in time or another, I'm not really trying to decipher which is the superior option, just maybe the most well rounded/bang for the buck option for a street truck going for it all (power, longevity etc)

So what's the take on rods? It would seem like the Carrillo connecting rods are the most popular, is that just because of cost and weight? Are they really the lightest option out there, and how many of you guys have opted to have the pin oiling holes added?

If anyone would care to share some info here, that would be awesome. I think it would be mutually beneficial for everyone to see the weights of the various options available, a cost breakdown and standard and available options for each manufacturer, all in one spot.

So, if anyone with that info, or ANY pertinent technical info about connecting rods and the differences between the available manufacturers offerings could post it up, again, that would be awesome to see.

I'm looking for;
Weight
Metallurgy
Pin bushing material used
Pin oiling option standard or available
H-beam or I-beam

And anything else that might help, please don't beat me up and trash talk about what I or anyone might "need" I am really hoping for this to become an informational and useful thread/tool for everyone to view

Thanks in advance!

 

[mike diesel]

Stick with carillos.

 

[NC-smokinlmm]

So now your building it again???

 

[Hot COCOAL]

So now your building it again???

Yup...
I mean, I've always intended on building it, but I got really dismayed when I lost that piston just 9 days after I added the VGT72 and 60's, along with the following build debacle, I was just done with it. Time heals tho and I'm ready to dig in

Couldn't just look at it anymore, don't want to piece it together just to run, I want it to rip. I was goin to buy a procharger D1 tuner kit for the LS2 in my TBSS, but I just couldn't do it with the D-max down and out, I got the TBSS to a really great point and I'm gonna leave it there till the D-max is DONE!

So, game on!
Lol

 

[ripmf666]

I've got a good plan of the parts I will be utilizing for my build, the meat of it is;
Jon's ovals
SoCal 3388 AF cam
SoCal girdle
LB7 crank
Dual fuelers (probably)
A few other misc. goodies
And a goal to hit 750 on this VGT72 as a single, and as time and mula allows, twin it someday and hit that almighty 1000whp benchmark

The two variables that I haven't nailed down yet are;
Which bearing set to use Clevite H or Hx? And why?

And, which connecting rod manufacturer to purchase?
Howard's, Carrillo, Crower or Manley?

I've haven't seen, read or heard much about the Crower's, other than Pat put one through a block a few years back and it was still straight.

I've read that Howard's come standard with pin oiling holes, but you can get them with Carrillo's for an extra $500

The H and HX there the se bearings just the HX is extra clearence. H series is a high performance bearing and P series is stock style replacement.
I built my motor before they had H series for them and there fine.

The oiling you will not find many running it. Think about the size of the hole and bearing surface would need a grooved bearing for a oil channel. The oil pressure and revaluation past the oil hole the pin hole really does not see much oil.

My build has Crowers the Carrillos were a lot higher at the time of the build.

If there is nothing wrong with your crank. I would stick with the Lbz think there is a few less that have failed over time.also you have a SoCal flywheel that would need replaced to a lb7 and swap the damper to a lb7 I think I saw you got one back awhile ago.

 

[LWATSON]

Subd, looking info also. Not to derail the rod discussion but one potential option I've been searching for info on is the no clearance piston rings. I've heard this term used but seen not much info on them and really don't know much at all about them. Anyone in the know on these rings?

 

[hondarider552]

Why a girdle? IMHO it's not needed.

 

[Andrew]

I agree with henry if your crank is still good I'd use it since you'd have a lot to replace just to use a different crank. If I can find the card that came with my Carrillo's I'll post the weights

 

[mackthehack]

Why an LB7 crank in an LBZ?

 

[motoking_1990]

Also not trying to derail, but what cranks are you guys running instead of the billets that seem to be failing? The factory cranks?


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[Hot COCOAL]

The H and HX there the se bearings just the HX is extra clearence. H series is a high performance bearing and P series is stock style replacement.
I built my motor before they had H series for them and there fine.

The oiling you will not find many running it. Think about the size of the hole and bearing surface would need a grooved bearing for a oil channel. The oil pressure and revaluation past the oil hole the pin hole really does not see much oil.

My build has Crowers the Carrillos were a lot higher at the time of the build.

If there is nothing wrong with your crank. I would stick with the Lbz think there is a few less that have failed over time.also you have a SoCal flywheel that would need replaced to a lb7 and swap the damper to a lb7 I think I saw you got one back awhile ago.

thank you for the valuable information Henry:thumb:
I think you brought up a pretty valid point regarding the pin oiling

yeah, I did get a billet flex plate, and after talking to Guy a bit he said he'd even use the crank that's there if it mag's out ok

it would cost a bit more to try and frankencrank the set up, at this point I think I'm gonna chance it with the stock one if it mag's out

Why a girdle? IMHO it's not needed.

I think you're right Brian, and after some helpful insight I'm not going to run a girdle, or billet mains. At this point, I'm planning to keep my power goals in a more attainable realm and I no longer want to spend the extra money in "hopes" that it will actually be beneficial for what I'm looking accomplish

Why an LB7 crank in an LBZ?

So, over the past 6mo I've talked to several reputable shops about this, and the census is basically that they hold up better. Each builder had their own reason for why they believed the LB7 crank held up better, one just said that the LB7 crank was stronger, one said that it had more mass and could tolerate the added forces of a performance tune and/or variations with the harmonic issues of the firing order, another builder just based his opinion on statistics claiming that he's seen fewer broken LB7 cranks in built motors

At any rate, I don't think there's a "solid" evaluation of the matter, although there seems to be a resounding agreement amongst the guys I talked to that it's a valid/worth while swap if you're going for big numbers, or to put it another way, not one said it was a bad idea or scratched their head and wondered why I would want to do it, instead, they said it's an added cost that I "don't really" need to incur

Also not trying to derail, but what cranks are you guys running instead of the billets that seem to be failing? The factory cranks?

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pretty much just a plain jane stock crank for the engine designation that you've got, that gets inspected and micro-polished

but like I said above, from my discussions I've had with several builders, it would seem like there is a trend leaning toward the LB7... :dunno:

 

[motoking_1990]

That's interesting thanks for the information cocoa. I'm just trying to gather as much information as I can for my upcoming build I just spent two hours reading the crank thread fingers started. Thanks again.

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[S Phinney]

For rod weights Howards are 1099 grams Carillo are around 8 grams less. Manley will be the heaviest of all of those. I use Howards and have a set of Manley for my DD when I build it. Howards have held up very well. I gave probably 8th or so on them. I would use H bearings. They hold up really well too. Do not use P series bearings. They will not hold up well in a high hp Dmax. You would notice substantial were from cylinder pressure using those. My first build had about 6th on it when I pulled it apart. You could see the wear starting to get through the babbitt into the copper.

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[flyintaco138]

When you have the crank is out are you planning having it cryo treated before the micro polish?