Duramax Diesels Forum Truck of the Week
  #106  
Old 01-24-2018, 02:24 PM
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Originally Posted by coker6365 View Post
We are currently working on a kit that will prevent the contaminants from entering the high pressure side
What about also doing something to help prevent the failures in the first place? After the failure of the CP4 in my VW I pinned the new pump I put in and also installed a carbide roller
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  #107  
Old 01-24-2018, 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Chevy1925 View Post
coker, is this like the s&s one that will take the "crank lubrication fuel" and put it in the return line and not the high pressure side as well as add the mesh screen?
The original design was similar but a mesh screen is added and not necessary in the case IMO. The new design will be a slightly different approach if it works correctly.
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  #108  
Old 01-24-2018, 02:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2004LB7 View Post
What about also doing something to help prevent the failures in the first place? After the failure of the CP4 in my VW I pinned the new pump I put in and also installed a carbide roller
At this time, the main goal is to simply prevent the contamination from spreading if a failure occurs and keep the install time/parts costs to a minimum. Otherwise, I would recommend a CP3 conversion over the prevention since the labor cost is so expensive to swap either pump out.

Did the first failure on the VW have a lift pump, lubricant additive, etc. running through it? I am curious as I believe lubrication and clean fuel goes a long way on these things.

My 3 LML's have a 33% failure rate ...
1 - 70k miles and original fuel system. Lift pump from about 10k miles on, deleted at 3000 miles.
2 - 196k miles and original fuel system. Bone stock until 192k miles. Deleted and lift pump at this time.
3 - 165k miles and 2nd fuel system. First system failed at 119k miles if I recall correctly. Deleted and lift pump since 163k miles.
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2015 Denali CC/SB LML, Farm Truck
2013 EC/SB LML, The Test Rig
2013 RC/LB LML, The Beater
2006 RC/LB LBZ, Tow Mirror Killer. Under the knife again and looking for more horsepuppies.

Big thanks to Josh Harris, Josh Chambers, and my brother Russell Coker for all the help with the LBZ.
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  #109  
Old 01-24-2018, 02:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2004LB7 View Post
What about also doing something to help prevent the failures in the first place? After the failure of the CP4 in my VW I pinned the new pump I put in and also installed a carbide roller
BTW, I like the pinned idea to keep the cup from spinning 180 degrees. I don't see how they are able to spin with the spring seat pressure unless they are getting stuck in the head and delay the downward travel on the camshaft but they do it.
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2015 Denali CC/SB LML, Farm Truck
2013 EC/SB LML, The Test Rig
2013 RC/LB LML, The Beater
2006 RC/LB LBZ, Tow Mirror Killer. Under the knife again and looking for more horsepuppies.

Big thanks to Josh Harris, Josh Chambers, and my brother Russell Coker for all the help with the LBZ.
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  #110  
Old 01-24-2018, 02:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coker6365 View Post
At this time, the main goal is to simply prevent the contamination from spreading if a failure occurs and keep the install time/parts costs to a minimum. Otherwise, I would recommend a CP3 conversion over the prevention since the labor cost is so expensive to swap either pump out.

Did the first failure on the VW have a lift pump, lubricant additive, etc. running through it? I am curious as I believe lubrication and clean fuel goes a long way on these things.
I could totally understand the cost part of it. Labor would be the killer.

VW uses an in tank lift pump that supplies I believe about 14 PSI then the fuel goes to an electric axillary pump that boosts it up to around 75 PSI. This feeds the CP4.

I did run some Diesel Kleen and 2 cycle oil but not as consistently as I would have liked. There is a huge thread over on TDIClub about it and there doesn't seem to be any clear consensus as to wether lubs help, clean fuel or not. Some have even added extra filtration and only fill up at the best stations and still experiencing failures. Its basically not an if but a when

I was just about ready to swap in a mini CP3 into it too before this VW emissions thing came along
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2006 BRM Jetta TDI. Injectors, turbo, Malone custom tuning on ecm and tcm
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  #111  
Old 01-24-2018, 03:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2004LB7 View Post
I could totally understand the cost part of it. Labor would be the killer.

VW uses an in tank lift pump that supplies I believe about 14 PSI then the fuel goes to an electric axillary pump that boosts it up to around 75 PSI. This feeds the CP4.

I did run some Diesel Kleen and 2 cycle oil but not as consistently as I would have liked. There is a huge thread over on TDIClub about it and there doesn't seem to be any clear consensus as to wether lubs help, clean fuel or not. Some have even added extra filtration and only fill up at the best stations and still experiencing failures. Its basically not an if but a when

I was just about ready to swap in a mini CP3 into it too before this VW emissions thing came along
I agree, way too many variables associated. Ford utilizes a single lift pump that supplies +55psi to function properly.

Build a mount and just throw an LBZ on it with a belt drive. Fuel for days!
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2013 EC/SB LML, The Test Rig
2013 RC/LB LML, The Beater
2006 RC/LB LBZ, Tow Mirror Killer. Under the knife again and looking for more horsepuppies.

Big thanks to Josh Harris, Josh Chambers, and my brother Russell Coker for all the help with the LBZ.
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  #112  
Old 01-24-2018, 04:27 PM
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The mini CP3 can supply more fuel then the original CP4.1 that comes in it. And only takes a small bracket that is made from a flat plate mounts right in the same location

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2008 Chevrolet 3500HD DRW LTZ
285/75/17 Nitto Dura Grapplers, 4.56 gears, Front and rear ARB lockers, Efi Live tuning by me, Raptor 160 LP, Cognito 4-6 NTB Lift, 4" Exhaust, Built Trans by Mike L.

2006 BRM Jetta TDI. Injectors, turbo, Malone custom tuning on ecm and tcm
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  #113  
Old 01-24-2018, 04:33 PM
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Originally Posted by coker6365 View Post
If anyone wants to donate some of those new CP4's in the pump kits, I am always available.
I'll sell you one of my NIB ones for $175 shipped

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  #114  
Old 01-24-2018, 10:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2004LB7 View Post
The mini CP3 can supply more fuel then the original CP4.1 that comes in it. And only takes a small bracket that is made from a flat plate mounts right in the same location

Nice, looks like a very simple swap.

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2013 EC/SB LML, The Test Rig
2013 RC/LB LML, The Beater
2006 RC/LB LBZ, Tow Mirror Killer. Under the knife again and looking for more horsepuppies.

Big thanks to Josh Harris, Josh Chambers, and my brother Russell Coker for all the help with the LBZ.
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  #115  
Old 01-24-2018, 10:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 04jimc View Post
I'll sell you one of my NIB ones for $175 shipped

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Donations only, lol. I just picked up a brand new one for $150. What I really want is a +2015 Ford CP4 to compare. It is suppose to flow about 9% more than the original.

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2015 Denali CC/SB LML, Farm Truck
2013 EC/SB LML, The Test Rig
2013 RC/LB LML, The Beater
2006 RC/LB LBZ, Tow Mirror Killer. Under the knife again and looking for more horsepuppies.

Big thanks to Josh Harris, Josh Chambers, and my brother Russell Coker for all the help with the LBZ.
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  #116  
Old 01-24-2018, 11:28 PM
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Does the Ford CP4 have the gear pump on the back? I have a CP4.2 without the gear pump that I have no use for

See here: http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=387252
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2006 BRM Jetta TDI. Injectors, turbo, Malone custom tuning on ecm and tcm
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  #117  
Old 01-25-2018, 04:42 AM
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Why do the Ford pumps not fail??

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08 GMC CC DRW-Gone
New DD/Beater: Beat up 06 GMC CCSB w/ 252,000 miles
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  #118  
Old 01-25-2018, 05:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2004LB7 View Post
Does the Ford CP4 have the gear pump on the back? I have a CP4.2 without the gear pump that I have no use for

See here: http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=387252
The Ford pumps do not have a gear pump, the regulator is relocated, FCA is ofset 90 degrees, and the suction/return is an oring fitting rather than hose clamps.

I have a good 2011-2014 Ford pump, would really like to snag a 15+ to see what they changed for the increased flow.

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2015 Denali CC/SB LML, Farm Truck
2013 EC/SB LML, The Test Rig
2013 RC/LB LML, The Beater
2006 RC/LB LBZ, Tow Mirror Killer. Under the knife again and looking for more horsepuppies.

Big thanks to Josh Harris, Josh Chambers, and my brother Russell Coker for all the help with the LBZ.
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  #119  
Old 01-25-2018, 05:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 04jimc View Post
Why do the Ford pumps not fail??

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The Ford pumps fail too, just not as often. I would guess it is due to the factory lift pump design rather than relying on a mechanical pump to pull a vacuum over such a long distance.

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2015 Denali CC/SB LML, Farm Truck
2013 EC/SB LML, The Test Rig
2013 RC/LB LML, The Beater
2006 RC/LB LBZ, Tow Mirror Killer. Under the knife again and looking for more horsepuppies.

Big thanks to Josh Harris, Josh Chambers, and my brother Russell Coker for all the help with the LBZ.
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  #120  
Old 01-25-2018, 05:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coker6365 View Post
The Ford pumps fail too, just not as often. I would guess it is due to the factory lift pump design rather than relying on a mechanical pump to pull a vacuum over such a long distance.

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True. Didn't think of that.

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03 Chev CC SB ZF6-Gone
04 GMC CC SB SLT LLY
597/1096 Batmostocker-Gone

06 GMC CC DRW-Gone
08 GMC CC DRW-Gone
New DD/Beater: Beat up 06 GMC CCSB w/ 252,000 miles
Current Tow Rig-12 Ram 4500 Crew


'Oughta K
now Better'- PPL Lim Pro Stock 05 3500 Crew Cab 158" WB 2014 PPP 2.6 Champions
Thanks to Blackout Performance

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